December 2, 2022

Episode #56: Marcia Barnes – Valve+Meter

As The Founder and CEO of Valve+Meter Performance Marketing, an INC 5000 and Best Places to Work company, Marcia Barnes knows a thing or two about growth. This woman of influence has made a career out of transforming businesses through profitable marketing programs.

She has received notable recognition for her leadership as President and CEO at Indianapolis-based DEFENDERS. Over the course of her 14-year tenure with the company, they grew from $2MM in annual revenue to more than $400MM.

Marcia is the recipient of the NAWBO Trailblazer Award, Women’s Business Enterprise of the Year for Indiana Award, and Amazon’s Best Seller status for her new book HERE WE GROW: The Marketing Formula to 10x Your Business and Transform Your Future. She lives in Indianapolis and has served on many boards including Truth at Work, and YWAM* Homes of Hope where she has participated in over 20 home builds in Mexico. Her favorite hobby is taking other business owners and their teams to experience mission trips in Mexico.

About Valve+Meter Performance Marketing

Valve+Meter is the expert in repeatable, profitable and scalable marketing. They are performance-driven, tactic agnostic, and start with Math Before Marketing™. On average, their clients experience a return on marketing spend of $8:1 through a mix of SEO, paid digital, email marketing and outbound lead gen efforts. They are on a mission to 10x the value of 100 businesses and would love for you to make the list. To request a FREE Marketing Assessment, visit


hello this is coach Tim Campsall and I’m your host for the self-made as a myth make a difference together show where we’re talking with successful business owners to hear their stories of the journey to building their business and because we know that success in business is not something that we can do on our own we are taking some time to recognize the folks who have helped us along our the way and helped us to excel today I’m excited to have a fellow business owner from Indiana with us today and my guest is a farmer’s daughter and made her own clothes and food growing up and so that’s pretty incredible we’re going to want to hear a little bit more about that in her downtime she loves watching old TV series and gets caught up in it and Compares today versus back then and uh when she has more time she gets away and does missions uh work and and trips and we’re going to ask her to tell us about her recent one here and she is most proud of her son and and his wife becoming uh parents and just the incredible job that they are doing uh raising their young family it’s my pleasure to welcome Marcia to the show today hello Marcia hi Tim how are you today I am so awesome thank you for asking well hey let’s start with having you introduce yourself tell us a little bit of your personal story like where you were born where you live about your family and and uh tell us about that missions trip sure um thanks Tim thanks for having me on we’re looking forward to the conversation today um I’m Marcia Barnes I’m the CEO and founder of valve and meter Performance Marketing and we help businesses achieve transformational growth here at valve and meter so we really enjoy doing that kind of comes from my past career as the marketer and and and CEO at Defender now it was called Defenders and it’s my last iteration they’ve been sold to ADT and no longer exist today but I’m the marketer That Grew that business from 2 million to over 400 million in Revenue ending up as the CEO and and over over about a 14-year career so valve and meter takes the marketing methods that we use there and helps other businesses grow exponentially with that so awesome work fun work um I started life in a place very familiar to Hoosiers because of the movie Hoosiers I lived in and grew up in Milan Indiana ah my dad was actually at the game he was in the eighth grade when that happened he had been to every game that season I just learned that just a few a couple months ago so it’s part of our deep culture um my dad was a farmer is a farmer in a way even in his 80s now he does some truck farming and sells things at the farmers market and still lives on the farm I was a farmer’s wife for 25 years so I’ve come from this strong farming background and became a businesswoman along the way and transitioned into being more of a city girl these days which I never thought would happen so many times you know yeah I like the position that you’ve taken with your podcast about the term self-made and the juxtaposition of that on what is really truth because I have been introduced before as being self-made and it’s one of the things that I will quickly and passionately change up because there’s nothing about me that’s self-made everything about me is Kingdom made you know I I grew up in a family where um we were poor my mother had a lot of issues mentally and was abusive and had some drug addictions and things that created just massive trauma for us as kids and typically you would look at that if you take the aces exam where they look at your your um your um childhood experiences whether they call it adverse childhood experiences is what Ace stands for and you take a quiz and it scores you on your likelihood to be able to how severe your childhood trauma was and the likelihood that you’ll be able to break that cycle and I score very high on that like 98 chance that I would end up in jail or addicted or abusive or you know all of the things right and that didn’t happen to me and it didn’t happen to my sisters you know we did not repeat those cycles and uh the the the way that you solve for that is the resiliency test tells you about who was in your life that was speaking into you and encouraging you and helping you adapt grandparents teachers School teachers coaches 4-H leaders friends aunts and uncles and we had that in Spades and in my business life it’s been the same thing where um it just seems like God puts just the right person in my path at the moment that I need a word or encouragement or a new methodology to keep moving forward and being able to be my best self I’m so good on you for recognizing that most people have that that thing working behind them you know so tell us about um yeah you mentioned uh to me ahead of time that your son has a a new newborn and and you’re a grandma so tell us about that yeah you know I like I said I was married to a farmer for 25 years and um my RJ’s dad and I separated um a few years ago and you know we’re very good friends we did a great job watching RJ parent today lets me know that even though there were a lot of differences between his dad and I we focused on we had shared values and shared shared beliefs as we’re raising the kids and watching RJ and my daughter-in-law Cody now raise Emerson and seeing how that’s multiplying um through my granddaughters just been such tremendous Joy you know Tim you don’t have grandchildren yet do you no you’re way too young um so so much has changed you know when I had children you learned from your mom and your grandmother and your aunts and your uncles and the Neighbors in the church ladies is out of raising baby everybody would tell you how to raise a baby well today the young parents have so much research and technology and answers coming to them at the uh oh by the way that’s my job She’s a Beauty but everything’s right here plus my daughter-in-law is a nurse so they they just they just have so much working for them on knowing what to do and one day I was over at their house and I picked up some device off the coffee table and I said so what’s this and and Cody told me the official name of it she says we call it a booger snatcher I said well we had one of those but it was like a syringe bulb that we would use and she goes yeah yeah those have to be replaced every 90 days because of the bacteria and I’m like oh

RJ said you didn’t you didn’t change that every 90 days did you I said no it made it all the way through your brother two years

they’re doing an awesome job and just the way they’re learning about each other and caring for one another and the deepening of their marriage and all of the love surrounding them is just precious to watch awesome so you just got back from a missions trip tell us about that I did I’ve been working with actually Dave Lindsey the owner of direct Defenders introduced me many years ago to about 2006 or seven to youth with the mission homes of Hope out of the San Diego Baja area and they build homes for the less fortunate in Ensenada and Tijuana and so I just finished my 20th mission trip with them about a month ago and I know it was my 20th but you know Tim it might have been 20 times better than any of the ones I’d been on and they’ve all been great you know but some of the differences were I traveled with a lot of other Business Leaders who were doing some fundraising for the ministry and there were so many Business Leaders from here in our city in Indianapolis God’s just really doing something great at the heart of our city I’m not sure what it is because everybody’s coming from all different directions in this participation but it’s remarkable and I took a young leader um young business leader who I’ve been mentoring for about a year with me she was really excited to accompany me on that trip and she just got so much of it I thought I was going to have to take a string and tie it around her ankle to keep her from floating off into the ocean but um I’ll give you one example um you know on this particular trip each year they bring in a Christian artist or band to perform um kind of a little concert there and so David Crowder’s done it Stephen Curtis Chapman Michael W Smith the big names in Christian music and this year we had a guy named Brenton Brown and none of us recognized him but he’s the songwriter that writes all these songs for these big artists you know songs we’re singing in churches and worship bands and listening to on the radio every day and Brenton usually the artist will come in and do their concert and leave but Brenton brought his family with him and participated in the build and the way this works is on day one you show up to the job site the family is there they have poured a concrete pad um to build the house on and the second day you’re going to leave with that house completed wired for electric Furniture is in there and bursaries and supplies and you hand off the keys and everybody’s life changes of course the family’s life changes that’s receiving the house but the volunteers who came to build and the missionaries and all the community around them yeah after 20 times of watching that it’s just such a wonderful thing well on the second day we take the family we take up donations and we take the family to the grocery store to get supplies and this particular time Brenton Brown finds himself on the grocery trip to the Walmart the Mexican Walmart and he gets this God nudge that the little girl in the family seven years old should have a bicycle and so he goes to the dad and says I’d like to get Romney a bicycle Romney is the the daughter of the house the the the the couple that was receiving the house and the father said it’s too much it’s too much he already had a couple grocery carts stacked full of stuff and it was overwhelming for him and Brenton convinced him that that he that would be good for the girl to get a bicycle so they take her to the bicycle aisle and it’s three steps Stacks High to the ceiling these bicycles and they tell her you can pick out any bike you want no Mexican kid really hears that they they never here pick whatever you want it’s it’s what’s the most affordable or the most practical and those things so as could be predicted she picks a bicycle off the top shelf and now we need the Walmart to bring the lift to get the bike down right and we wait and we wait and we wait and we’re and the the we’re gonna we’re now starting to fall behind schedule to get back to the build site and keep the rest of the day on on program so the father says Rami go ahead and pick a bike from the bottom shelf so that we can go back to the house which she was looking forward to that but she reluctantly picks the second choice and the men are trying to get this bicycle off that bottom shelf and it’s jammed in there somehow and they can’t get it loose and they’re working with it working with it and working with it and they cannot get it loosed now in hindsight I picture two angels back there just holding on to it going not this one and now the lift comes from the Walmart and they go up and they get the bicycle and they bring this bicycle down to Romney and set it in front of her and as luck would have it the designer of the bike was named Romney and her name is in big letters across the seat of that bicycle and we were all just stumbled but then on top of that one of Brenton Brown’s most recent releases is he knows my name and it was just such a blessing to see that it was you know God is a relational God and just showing up and touching all of us in different ways and very deeply in that moment you know not cool wow thank you for sharing um Marcia tell us about how the business came about and at what point did you have the confidence that you could run your own business um well I owned my own business before I I I this is actually my fourth startup so um I had done a couple of things before I met Defenders and then I remember the company I had when I met Defenders I merged in with uh with them and then um I had part ownership there and so when I exited in 2013 I took a year off and I felt like you know we’ve created this consistent result using math as part of the marketing deliverable you know for every dollar that you invest in marketing how many dollars of Revenue or gross profit should we be seeing come back and those those conversations had been disconnected in my opinion from in the marketing conversation businesses don’t buy marketing correctly agencies don’t sell it correctly and neither one tracks correctly so I thought we could reorient that you know so we started valve and meter start I started down this path that today is valve and meter and um we’ve been at this for just about six years now and my customer facing goal is to 10x the valuation of a hundred businesses and we’ve done that several times already and have a handful of others underway awesome um we’re trying to help people create abundance out of their business because typically that gives them more they’re hiring more people and we’re creating more jobs and we’re able to do more philanthropic work and the influence expands and I want people to be able to experience that so that’s kind of the path that got us here yeah I I like the your reference to abundance we teach that as well in fact our vision is World abundance through business re-education and that odd or the principle is right when you figure it out right the sky’s the limit in terms of you know the success that you can have in your business right I love how how aligned it sounds like we are so absolutely Marcia share a story where someone pushed you or inspired you that you could do it even though maybe you didn’t think you could and the impact of that individual had on you yeah

I do I have a keynote speech that I do is forming your your personal Board of advisors and one of the four positions I highly recommend is someone who sees greatness in you before you can see it in yourself you know and uh again and my journey has put many people along along my path that have done that um Dave Lindsey was probably very critical in that in that he was almost always I never asked for a promotion ever I never asked him about hey let me sell you my business he was always tapping me on the shoulder and saying because you do this well I think you’re ready to do that I think you could make big changes if you did that and he did that on the merger he did it on from director of marketing to VP of marketing VP of sales and marketing CMO president CEO and president every time it was a position I was refusing yeah and he’s saying here’s the reasons why I think you can do that and that you know for me when I look at the way many women and my age have been passed over in the marketplace during that season yeah yeah again that’s why I watch these Pop Pop Culture comparisons to TV shows right um for you know and I don’t get me wrong I worked hard and I really got results and I deserved every one of those promotions but I did not I did not work to get promoted I work to serve others I work to create abundance I work to help people achieve their goals and um so he was very Visionary and being able to do that you know yeah that’s awesome I love it that is fantastic a little before his time maybe yeah absolutely I as you were asking me the question there were two people I was kind of pivoting between but I could probably give you another good story too prior today my work with Dave yeah and I had a business partner Evelyn and Evelyn had uh she was about she was from my same small town and she was about 15 years older than me and when I was a child she owned the Sears store in our small town and she was a dead ringer for Barbara Eden you remember I Dream of Jeannie worship oh yeah yeah thing and stuff would appear you know and Beyond the Sears store and whenever my parents would order like our school clothes or Christmas gifts or whatever she would wait on us at the counter and then go through these doors and come out with the packages you know and we were just sure she was back there creating these packages you know 20 years later I find myself in Business Partnership with Evelyn who I really loved and respected a lot and at the time I had a really severe you know again you heard me talk about watching these old TV shows but I was really addicted to daytime soap operas and this is the era of the VCR and so I’m recording you know I’m recording all these soap operas and I’m watching them you know I’m skipping commercials and I’ve got very efficient at watching soap operas you know and one time I showed up at the office one day and I was kind of Grouchy and cranky and I hadn’t sold anything before noon which was super unusual and Evelyn came to me she goes what’s going into you today you’re just not yourself and I said well Evelyn I can’t believe it but on The Guiding Light yesterday they killed off the guy who has been on the show since it started wrestling there was no sickness no trauma no kidnapping nothing they just hit me with it all at once and she just she was real small and real short she just looked up at me and she put her finger right in my chin she goes I cannot believe someone as smart as you is so stupid to do that with their time

and Tim you know I was so mad I was stomping back to my corner I stewed about it all day you know I said well how dare she tell me what I can do in my spare time if I’m gonna watch the soap operas you know I get home that night and I’m cooking dinner real fast so we can eat dinner and and I’m sitting at the table with the kids and I’m thinking about getting over to watch the stories you know and um and RJ said mom do you think Brooke is going to go back to what was the guy Thorn do you think Brook’s gonna go back to Thornton to Ridge you think Brooke’s gonna there’s people who will listen to this who know what I’m talking about that’s gonna return to Ridge because he’s just a big cheater with Taylor and I went uh because the boys had been playing in the morning sitting in the room watching these things with me and in their little um seven and four-year-old minds they’re they’re like what do you think’s gonna happen they’re doing the same thing I am they’re already gonna head to the soap opera and I go boys why don’t you help me with the dishes and then let’s do something a little different tonight you know and so played a board game and then I read them for the first time picked up Chronicles of Narnia and started reading with them before they went to bed and we never watched the soap operas again and you know Evelyn was so courageous to speak so directly into me and in front of me and uh and I’ve listened right and watched for the other guiding signs coming from the kids and followed through on it and man I got so much more productive after that that is an awesome story wow um tell us your biggest learning as a business owner well in this season of my life you know I’ve led a company at 400 million dollars in revenue and 2 600 employees and you could pretty much walk out the door and say dude I need this you need to do this yeah all these resources you know um and today you know we have 45 team members and oh my gosh they’re just such a treasure just such talented people that we have here at valve and Manor it’s a joy to show up every day um but it’s a different this is a different world than what I’ve ever worked in you know it’s partially remote you know partially hybrid some people are in the office I have a wide range of Ages and genders and different levels of interest and where people are at on what’s important to them and so it seems like you’re you’re needing to constantly vet test iterate renew the what you think you know to be true right there are a few things I know that are need that have to be true we need to love people we need to serve them well when we’re doing that well people give us permission to lead them and when we have that we get transformational results I know those things to be truth all the way through my career but whether that’s here on a screen or across the table for with the coffee yeah or if it’s in a coaching session or if we’re analyzing somebody’s marketing results or if we’re just hanging out at their soccer game all of these things are different than they were 10 20 30 years ago you know wow so as you think about um your your career as you know running businesses and and the backdrop here is we know that that business success doesn’t happen in isolation you you mentioned that earlier so tell us about one of the biggest challenges you faced as a business owner and and maybe a fellow business owner that came alongside you and helped you to get through that sure boy a lot of people have really stepped in for me over the years um you know um I don’t know if you’ve heard if you’ve met him before but Bob Massey with naptown media here in the city he um he came alongside of me about 15 years ago as a mentor he he was one of the vendors that I was working with on Direct Mail and he was helping me win in marketing and when I was at Defenders and our businesses really grew together a lot but we really connected and he was a good sounding board and coach and Mentor for me over the years um and he was one of those people again that saw greatness in me that I wasn’t seeing in myself and so he would remind me of of what you’ve just done or this this last step that you took is so difficult to do make sure you understand how good you are at it you know and today we still are in business relationship he helps with a lot of of high-end video work that we do here for Fortune 500 companies he’s a brilliant creative mind brilliant data mine he’s actually I didn’t know this until he won the Sagamore award is that what they call it Sagamore award PT McAllister actually awarded it to him from the governor um he is a Mensa but he also he tests in the top 10 of Menses oh wow so he’s Hoover brilliant but he’s he’s able to translate that so clearly to an average intelligence person like me

um into things that are actionable you know um so he’s really been quite a blessing to me over the years and there are many many people like this you know wonderful well I’m going to ask you to to try to pick three so if there are three people in your business owner owner Journey that you’re most grateful for being there um to as part of and helping you with your business growth who are those three people and how they help you oh man it’s gonna be hard to leave anybody out here you’re gonna be in some trouble but you know I think um when I talked about Dave Lindsey earlier the journey that we went on together um was remarkable and amazing and just Godly Godly appointed and anointed and those things and um we were professional arguers you know we we fought so openly and freely it made everyone else in the room uncomfortable I love that yeah well people would advise against that today whatever it was worked for us you know and um I know I remember one time early on right after I had merged my business in with Dave’s um I came out of his office after one of these blistering shouting things back and forth and his assistant followed me to the restroom and she said you know I watched the rest of the executive team go in and out there all day long and all they do is say yes I hear you go in and she said that door’s then and I hear it what do you think is best for him you’re not just arguing with him for your position you’re arguing him for the best position and so this front line executive assistant spoke that into me which caused me to go back to Dave and say is this is what Tracy said is that the way you see it he said yes while you’re on this team so I think that was a super blessing for me um another person that’s been incredible is Tom Daphne has actually just talked to Tom this morning Tom’s been my financial advisor for years and he’s part of Ron blue trust today Tom daphnos and Tom has um he’s kind of taken me on kind of adopted me under his wing over the years he likes to root for The Underdogs but he’s really good at keeping me aligned on what’s important between spirituality wealth philanthropy you know he knows my heart and I want to be generous and and help break cycles of poverty addiction and abuse and he has just been such a good voice into my life that way as well um my my business partner Evelyn just had a huge impact on my life she kind of my own mother was had a difficult time um seeing value in me or being able to speak into that it was more it was not a healthy relationship so that one was kind of that adopted mother force that was in there plus business and um she really helped me and I helped I helped her finish her career career really strong um in a very well a very generous way too um but she invested in me and and really really was a big help to my development yeah so Marcia if we shift gears a little bit here and think about the next three to five years what are the biggest challenges that you see that um are between you and and reaching your goals and who are the types of people that you’re going to need to allow you to overcome those challenges sure you know um the the the the leadership team here and the whole of the team here is doing a really good job running the business so I work on the front of bringing in Revenue um I I need I I’m I’m working currently working on duplicating um the sales capability with with other people on my team um I have a book coming out in the spring which will put me on excuse me the marketing front more than the sales front right and um I I want to be there because that’s where I can wield influence not for our business our business certainly benefits from it but the book has a faith-based thread through it it’s not even a threat it’s faith-based business book right but you don’t see a lot of oh that’s awesome yeah and so it gives me a platform to speak from um I have Parkinson’s disease so I find that actually I had it happen this week where where it helps other people to see how they can still be great at business even though they might have a physical setback sure um so there’s a lot there’s a lot of things in that but I’m I’m moving more um consistently towards Ministry I’m heavily involved with truth at work that puts together roundtables for Christian business owners I’m on the board there I can see myself doing that the rest of my career I don’t really have a retirement thing in mind I don’t think it’s biblical certainly not on the horizon for me so um but I’m I’m trying to use the skills I have to be out there helping encourage other people and put tools and and Connections in front of them to help them to create abundance you know I love it Jim Rohn said we become the average of the five people that we spend the most time with so as you think about that what advice do you have for business owners who are doing it on their own or or think that they need to do it on their own yeah I I think you’ve got to get in in peer groups I I I think this you talk about in your branding that this is lonely space and that can be true if you let it be um isolation I think is where Darkness happens and where where things can fall apart for you and being your strongest self ever um so finding those um groups whether it’s action coach or YPO or vistage or you know name there’s a there’s all different flavors of this yes they’re finding the one that fits you the best and where you can be served to the level of your needs at that time is super important um so I I I’m heavy fan of peer groups yeah I love it yeah if you I I can’t count how many people have told business owners who have told me that that quote that it’s very lonely at the top and right they don’t have anyone to talk things out loud with and they don’t want to take the the burden or the stress home and and you know share it with their significant others so they’re just holding on to it all by themselves and you know trying to carry that weight yeah and I meant four or five of those types of things in fact I’m in the accelerant Group which technically is a business networking group um but I was at the partners meeting this past month and we have a new member I’d never met and I I was on the panel speaking and I came off the stage and you 29 year old owner and he comes running up to me and he goes I’m pretty sure you’ve got something neurological going on like yeah it’s Parkinson’s disease and he starts telling me what’s been going on with him you know and I can’t I don’t I had never heard of what it was he was talking about but he’s he has to take he has Tremor like I do he has movement disorder like I do but he has to take chemotherapy and it has leukemia types of manifestations it’s horrible what he always going through and he’s like I was so happy to be here tonight and see somebody with a disability out there doing it just like I am and he gives me a big hug and I was like you know I was here for business but what I received was a gift yeah wow that is fantastic so Marcia it sounds like you’ve had some pretty incredible people in your your life and in your business Journey if they were all here on the show with us today what would you want to say to them um thanks for listening to God’s call on my life you know yeah I love it um tell us more about your are you can you tell us about your book is it something that you’re able to share yeah um the book’s Called Here We Grow um the plot the I’m sorry the framework to 10x your results and transform your lives the first three chapters deal with the story of my origin story through Defenders and how what Dave and I created there the the next three chapters deal with math before marketing which is the lunch pin of what I think is broken in marketing and then if you’re growing your business you’ve got to grow yourself as a leader and you got to grow leaders around you and grow good cultures so we have three chapters on that and ends with a chapter on a call for a call to abundance and philanthropy and giving and how to develop that strategy and outcome um faith-based threads through it um stories of people and the the impact that folks have had on me in my life all through that so it’s a labor of love so well congratulations I can’t wait to to see it when it comes out you’ve talked a couple times today about um the math of marketing and and it again I think we’re on a similar wavelength because we teach our clients that marketing is math right that you should be able to evaluate it and calculate the return on investment and don’t you know don’t get caught in the Trap of you know it’s all about branding and and not about lead generation and right as a small business owner you branding doesn’t pay the bills and it’s just incredible that there’s not very many people that are saying the message you are so I I just I love that that you shared that today because sometimes I feel like I’m on an island no it’s it’s it’s true way too many people are focused it’s more on brand than they are on on getting a return you know and and if you if you if you go entirely towards what I might Orient towards you might be too heavy on everything has to have math right and if you go too heavy on branding everything’s branding you’re you’re gonna you’re gonna not have a brand because you never got any customers you know right but there’s this balance you know and so typically with the clients I work with I encourage them no more than 30 percent of your marketing budget should be spent on marketing as a reach would be 40. um you know I’ll see one and a half million dollar HVAC contractors for expense for example trying to create a brand in this city when they’ve got 40 50 million dollar competitors um with a whole lot more resources and they’ll be like but I’m on TV and I’m on radio just like them but the amount of TV and radio you’re doing compared to them is like a pimple on an elephant’s hair right so why not use that money to buy some more keywords or create more pages on your website yes where they might be neglecting that and so that’s like a constant conversation with it with an example of a client we would have yeah um I had somebody give me a book they had gotten in a trade show that said what was it lies marketing and more than lies I think it was called but it had a chapter and the reason the person had given it to me was it had a chapter in there about how you can’t track marketing you can’t track the return and this was somebody who had been in Fortune 500 companies and all this stuff saying it doesn’t matter you’d want to do it this way and I’m sure that they’re winning from that position in certain assignments but the things that I’ve done historically that have gotten these returns have not been that way and I will keep every book that someone gives me and find someone else to hand it to but that one went in the trash that’s a dangerous message you know right yeah so yeah Amen to that well Marcia it has been an absolute pleasure speaking with you today thanks for being on the show yeah thank you Tim it’s so great the type of message you’re trying to get out there with people very encouraging for Business Leaders and owners to know that they need to be watching for how they became who they’re becoming yeah awesome to everyone who tuned in thanks for listening to the self-made is a missed show with your host coach Tim cancel be sure to help us spread this Movement by liking the show and posting it on your social media and to join our movement go to all right folks that’s a wrap make sure to pay it forward and I’ll see you all next time take care