May 6, 2022

Episode #34: Jason Barnaby – Firestarters

Jason Barnaby is the Chief Fire Starter and Tribe Leader of Fire Starters Inc—a company he founded after receiving the gift of severance in 2018. His vision is simple: change the world one fiery heart at a time. His mission is simpler. Two hashtags: #ignitehope and #torchfear.

To assist in this vision and mission, Jason has authored two books, Igniting the Fire Starter Within and the 30 Days to Blaze Journaling Workbook. Whether it’s guiding a leadership group through 30 Days to Blaze for leaders, an interactive keynote, or executive coaching, Jason delivers his content with great passion and energy and a lifetime of experience while helping his clients bring their skills, gifts and purpose into fiery alignment. You can find out more at his website:


hello this is coach tim campsall and i’m your host for self made as a myth make a difference together show where we’re talking with successful business owners to hear their story of the journeys to building their business and because we know that achieving success in business is not something that we can do on our own we are taking time to recognize the folks who helped us to excel i’m excited to have a fellow business owner and a friend uh from indiana with us today my guest has listened to this he surpassed 10 000 hours of speaking and facilitating uh other people and this comes from the book the tipping point so if you haven’t read that definitely you want to put that on your list in his downtime he enjoys listening to and playing music and he’s a proud he is most proud of keeping his business going during all the craziness that we’ve all experienced over the last couple years and listen to this having his best year ever please join me in welcoming my guest jason to the show today hello jason hey tim thanks for having me absolutely man well hey let’s start with having you introduce yourself tell us your personal story where you’re born and live and your family and all that fun stuff yeah um the quick the quick version is i am a a born and bred hoosier so i was born in bloomington indiana i didn’t stay for very long uh wound up going back there for college spent most of my time in indianapolis grew up in the same house from the time i was in kindergarten until i was until i graduated from college uh did a short stint as a i’ll put this in quotes as a professional ski bum in colorado for two years after college for those of you who’ve never heard that term before that just means that i worked really hard to ski as much as i possibly could that’s why professionals in uh air quotes um still really not knowing what i wanted to be or do when i grew up i found myself overseas on a short-term mission trip where i fell in love with one of our translators international language of love she was studying to be an english teacher and we met i moved to poland 11 months later we were married almost one year to the date that we met wow yeah and this is i’m gonna i’m gonna date myself here this was pre like everybody having internet and definitely pre uh smartphones so so this will really date me and some people listening may not even know what the heck i’m talking about but we sent uh cassette tapes back and forth to each other that we talked on oh wow a lot cheaper than talking on the phone and uh yeah i had a i had a 550 long distance phone bill one month and i realized i could have literally gone and visited her in person for about the same amount of money uh we have three children uh the oldest is 23 the middle is 18 and the youngest is 14 two boys and a girl the two boys were both born in poland the daughter was born here in the states and um yeah it keeps us hopping and my wife you know during the pan well just before the pandemic uh we had stopped homeschooling our our two that were home and so we’re like hey they’re gonna be gone this is great um she’s like yeah i’ll go back to school so she’s in a master’s program to become a certified mental health counselor and which is amazing because she’s i mean she has definitely found her calling found her ember found her fire for sure um but what happened was um everybody came home because that’s when kova happened so suddenly uh instead of her just being at home you know with no distractions and just focusing on school i was home with my business in these four walls uh here in my studio and office and we had uh it was it was as many people can relate to it was just not optimal um so yeah and we will uh it is may officially we will celebrate uh 25 years of marriage this uh this month the end of this month so congratulations yeah it’s pretty crazy tell us a little bit more about the music i’ve had the benefit of uh seeing some of your your your skits and stuff you put on social life yeah uh have always loved music i was a saxophone player in middle school and in high school i wish somebody could have showed me like the sax player from dave matthews band or somebody like that i probably would have still been playing um because that’s i just think those guys are really cool but i just i love music i love finding a way to express yourself and i think about how i think about what i do and and taking my skills and my abilities and putting those out there in the world and inspiring people and what would happen if i didn’t do that like i got a message today on linkedin and a lady said she had shared a post that i put and i said i said thank you i commented on it and she said thank you for being so inspirational and i just thought like oh wow if i wouldn’t have done that maybe she would have found it somewhere else but maybe she wouldn’t have and i just think about how many of my memories are tied to a particular song or a genre of songs or a concert um i think that’s why and music is just so unbelievably powerful and uh so i’ve i’ve i i was not a great undergrad student at iu um one of the classes i did take was a very basic guitar class that just taught me some some just everyday chords and that’s kind of where it started so i’ve i’ve led music off and on in in small and big churches and uh in the states and in poland but i really like to just pull it out and like i like that song and um i think it was i know you you too has sung about this but all i i think it was dylan originally said all i need is a the red guitar three chords and the truth and uh if you can throw in a minor chord so maybe four chords you can pretty much play any song that’s ever been written especially anything that’s on the pop pop radio but i just i love it i like to write music i like to um i didn’t believe i didn’t really know and then also didn’t believe my friends who told me that they thought i had a good voice until i was well into college and i was living next to a guy who was a voice major he was a base uh base major and he walked around with a scarf on even in the winter in the summer time to keep his vocal cords warm oh wow and i said hey i’ve been told that i have a good voice can you help me figure out if that’s true so we took a cassette player to the school of music into one of the little rehearsal rooms and i sang my one of my favorite u2 songs that has it goes from low to high range and he was like yep you can sing and i was like okay cool and that was kind of off and running from there so awesome yeah so jason is there a funny story that your family likes to tell about you that you’d be willing to share today yeah so funny i mean they laugh about it i can laugh about it i can laugh about it now so you can’t tell now but when i was when i was younger i had a very full very big red afro of hair and it was very red and this is at the time that happy days is on television so ralph mouth and richie cunningham and opie taylor bozo the clown who had a very red wig was also like a kids show that was on tv and tons of freckles and i had a bit of a i kind of i was told as a kid that redheads should have a temper so i kind of i kind of used that i think as an excuse but i hold the record for the only grandchild and there were there are nine of us um that were around my family growing up uh i am the only grandchild that my grandfather ever spanked um and that is because i threw a fit in a store and i still remember it to this day i remember my grandfather was a man like many men in those days a very few words and the words he said he meant and uh i asked for something in the store and he said no and that was supposed to be the end of the discussion and i to me that was the beginning of the discussion so i threw an absolute fit i threw myself on the ground and just started screaming and kicking i think i was like i don’t know four or fives and i’m i’m just throwing a holy fit to the point that people were coming to the to the aisle because they’re you know it was loud enough that it was causing a bit of a ruckus he looked down still very calm and he said get up and i took that opportunity to not listen and to double down on the fit thinking that would really help me get my way and this will tell you how much times have changed he picked me up and pulled down my pants and my underwear and spanked my bare butt in this in this store and i i tell you what i i was so shocked that he did that that i quit quit screaming immediately and here’s how different the times were when we i think he dropped whatever he had and just took me out to the car um but there was a lady standing at the end of the aisle and her comment was good for you way to show that brat who’s boss and i just i remember even at five i was i was offended i was like like you’re supposed i’m a kid but uh yeah the only card-carrying member of the only grandchild that my grandfather ever spanked so nice thank you for sharing yeah claim to fame jason tell us about how the business came to be and at what point did you have the confidence that you could run your own business ah so the business came through you know even when i even when i was a ski bum in colorado my dad was growing up my whole life my dad was owned his own business um he owned a construction company he did custom remodeling he was very creative and he was very good at what he did and i think i was born with that entrepreneurial bug my mind is always going somebody should do something about that that’s a business idea you know so it was just always there and i don’t remember him specifically you know like grooming me for any of that or talking about that as when i was a kid it just i it’s just something i think i inherited from him and so i used to carry around a either a manila folder or a wire-bound notebook sometimes the the notebook had been shoved in the manila folder or vice versa and i would put things in there if i found an article that i liked or if i had a good customer service experience i would jot down like what i liked about it or if i had a bad customer experience i would write down those things or if i had an idea for a business and i carried them around with the uh with the initials mob on there which stood for my own business so i always knew that someday something whether it would be a side hustle or i just always knew that because i was a kid too like i i was a newspaper delivery boy when i was 10 so like i was always like we would sell we would go pick up aluminum cans we’re always looking for ways to make money and so you know i think part of it came from that and so i knew that that was something that i wanted to do i really enjoy speaking i really enjoy being in front of people i love facilitating um and so i you know in my mind i’m like man if i could marry those things together but i had no idea where to start and so i’m gonna give a shout out to jennifer robbins uh who is a a consultant here in indianapolis who helps probably many people that you and i know um collectively has helped them she at one time i think was brendan burchard’s ceo and she went off and started her own business basically helping people like us figure out a framework for their business and so i came to her and i said hey i i have this i i have some ideas and i had been told about her and i had actually been told by really good friends she said you’re not ready to meet jenny yet but when you are it’s going to be really great and i was like okay i don’t even really know what you’re talking about but sure and so i met with jenny and i had gone through and looked at the mob because i still had it you know um looked at all the things threw some things away and kind of narrowed it down and gave that to her not really to look at but just like went through it with her and said here’s you know here’s what i think but i have no idea how this could be a business and so i hired her uh i paid for it on a credit card because i didn’t have the money but i’m like i’m going in i think this is a good deal and i really think she can help me and uh we had three meetings and after the i think after the at the end of the second meeting we had a framework which is still really the framework that i use today which is uh find your find your fire fan your flame intend your tribe it’s actually on the back of this t-shirt that i’m wearing i think that’s on this one

and so we you know i started collecting my lifetime of stories and experiences and i had been a franklin covey facilitator i had done customer service training i’d done all kinds of training and at that time i was also writing a book so there was you know there was decision to finish the book took me longer than i would have liked to and uh the the question about when did i get the courage so that’s kind of interesting i would love to tell you like you know i finally got up one day and i’m like this is the day i’m gonna like i’m gonna do it like you know a jerry maguire moment you know like you you just muster up the courage to make this big stand and honestly the courage came from my job being eliminated that i was in for almost 10 years it was like nine years and 10 months i knew that was coming um i could see the writing on the wall had a very candid conversation with my boss when i knew that that was coming um that’s when i hired ginny and we started doing this because i knew it was coming and i got a severance package for six months and it’s like all right we’ll just treat this as a small business grant that i don’t have to pay back and uh let’s let’s go for it and that will be uh next week will be four years that i’ve been full-time which is kind of amazing congratulations can you believe it thank you well jason tell us a little bit more about fire starters what do you guys do how do you help people and and yeah people find out and you’ll get in touch with you um so it took me a while to really name the product because when you’re in training and development i think the products can be a lot of different things you know you can do sales training you can do customer service training you can do um you know personal coaching type stuff what i really say is that my product is what i refer to as actionable inspiration so i think many of us uh probably people listening i’m sure you have i know i have have gone to conferences and you write down some things and you’re like man this is so good and it’s you know you’re gonna take all these action steps you’re gonna do all these things and uh you write it down and you find that notebook six months later and you go i have no idea what these things even mean that i wrote down i’m sure they were important at the time but clearly i’ve done nothing with them and i don’t even remember where i wrote them down so my goal um and i think you know the goal really is the actionable inspiration piece and it comes in a couple of different ways so if i am working with a group and i come and speak as the keynote speaker we will i call it an interactive keynote so we will do things during the keynote where i will maybe even tell you like take a minute or two to have a think or share with somebody next to you um always in my keynotes with what’s one thing that you’re going to do as a result of the time that we’ve had together and tell somebody who’s next to you text somebody that if you don’t know the people at your table or that you’re sitting around but make sure that you have someone around you who can hold you accountable because uh the statistics are very clear in that situation when you tell somebody that you’re well when you write it down and tell somebody and then even more if we ask them to hold us accountable i like the you to use the word support i think accountability has kind of gotten a bad rap like it’s more like i’m going to smack you if you get out of line so find somebody who’s going to support you so in a keynote situation it’s actionable inspiration i wrote my first book it’s called igniting the fire starter within it’s really about like do you know one of the questions i ask in um in keynotes is do you know what sets your heart on fire and i’m amazed at how many people don’t know i’m also amazed at how many people know but are are intentionally not doing that thing because it either scares them or they don’t see it as a possibility we have a very dualistic mindset i think in this country it either has to be full-time or nothing you know or i gotta go do all this and leave all of this and um my thing is like what if you just took one step in the direction of that thing right like could you join a board of a non-profit and maybe do some of that like they don’t have to pay you right can can you maybe do some side consulting for a friend that something that you really love to do um and just taking one step in that direction yeah so that’s another piece and then as a follow-up to the book which i wasn’t expecting many people said great i read your book i’m i’m i’m inspired i want to change my life but i don’t know what to do so what do i do and my master’s degree is in curriculum design so i wrote a book called 30 days to blaze and it’s really actionable inspiration one day at a time for 30 days so i take teams through that so it really was great to do during covid i did it with several teams during covet because you can only do online bingo and online happy hour and online whatever it is for so long and this is a combination of personal and professional development so you learn some things about the people that you’re in the group with you learn some things about yourself they learn some things about you but it’s my question to the group is always okay you just learned that this is a limiting belief that you have how can you take that back to the organization where you work and be a better version of you what is something that you need to do again the actionable inspiration piece and then the other one which i did a lot more of during covid just because gigs just people were canceling them they you know weren’t comfortable doing them online or whatever is i do a lot of one-on-one personal coaching and i i love the up close and personal seat that you get to people’s development and um i’ve always said i’ve been in adult education for 25 years and to me one of the biggest highs of that profession is being a part of somebody’s aha moment yeah so when you you know i know you’ve seen that as you coach people but when they’re when they’re when the when you see the flash in their eyes and they like you know it’s literally that it’s a and they and and then like i love that because i know what’s coming because i’ve seen it so many times and it makes me kind of emotional thinking about it but it’s just you know people and then they’re like oh my gosh and all that like i didn’t know or i didn’t understand or now i see and oh that’s it’s just this it’s it’s like the the curtain has parted and there’s just this you know this whole new world that’s there that they didn’t know that was there and uh to be able to be close enough to someone because a lot of times it is literally face to face or sitting next to somebody talking about something um and to be a part of that ugh i mean i joke that if if that that is my drug of choice like that that feeling and if i could find a way to put that in some sort of a smoothie as like you know protein powder or something man i would drink that every single day because it’s just it’s it’s an amazing feeling yeah i love that yeah we um we we call that moment the blinding flashes of the obvious yes yeah where right it’s it’s not usually rocket science right we don’t teach them something brand new help them connect two dots right that’s yeah yeah and that’s i think that’s what’s the most fun too is that you’re pulling something out of them that they already knew they just didn’t realize that they knew it and that’s even more fun yeah and and they’re more excited to do it because they realize i mean i think anyway if you’re doing it right it should be their idea anyway right and so if it’s their idea you’re just you just help them get there and that’s it’s a privilege and i i don’t i i know a few other honors and privileges in this world than being able to walk with somebody down that road to do that yeah so jason share a story where someone pushed you or inspired you that you could do it even though maybe you didn’t think you could and the impact that person had on you yeah uh that’s an easy one and i i’ve told this story many times but the person that came right to mind when i thought about that question is my friend brian neal from blind zebra consulting um if you’re from around indy and listening to this you probably know brian he does sales coaching he’s been doing sales coaching for multiple years he’s also an nfl referee and this year he got his he uh fulfilled a goal that he’s had since he was 19 of uh refereeing in the super bowl which is pretty amazing but we had lunch oh gosh probably

eight nine years ago something like that i didn’t really know what he was doing i mean i’d heard the word consultant and i didn’t really know what that meant so we had lunch and i said what do you what do you do and he’s telling me what he does i was like wow that sounds really fun and sounds really cool and i love the concept that you have and all this stuff and he goes well you could do that and you know it was one of those like like are you talking you’re talking me you’re talking to me and he’s like he’s like dude and he’s known me since college and he said i’ve known you since college he’s like you are one of the most authentic leaders that i’ve ever known and he said here’s what i want you to know and i’m telling you right now tim i did not believe him when he told me this he said all that stuff that you do all that stuff that has made you who you are today 75 of the world doesn’t know that and i completely i i vehemently disagreed with him i said there is no way the 75 of the world doesn’t know that like it’s like what we just said like it’s not rocket science right it’s just there’s no way and he said and the other 25 that does know still needs to be reminded so either way you have a willing audience well i set out to set to prove him wrong over the next year and i actually found out that it’s not 75 it’s like 90 and i was just i was blown away and i’m i’m continuing i’ve been doing this you know i’ve i’ve spoken in front of people for for decades and i’ve i share some of the things with my audiences that i shared with my students when i was a university professor in poland it’s just it’s still the same thing and there are times when i’m giving a keynote and and i will almost like ah that’s so obvious should i even share that and i’ll share it and inevitably i will have at least two if not five people come up afterwards and say oh that thing you said oh that was so good and i’m like that thing that thing that literally i’ve been saying for 25 years like that like what about this nugget that i spent like the last two months crafting and like nobody says anything about that thing it’s the thing and i’m like and every time it happens i just i kind of you know i look up at the i’m like yep brian you were right um and and he told me he said you should be doing this and uh i will tell you that what i struggled with the most not as much anymore still from time to time but definitely at the beginning was i don’t have anything to say and even if i did nobody would want to listen and uh when i got out of my own way and realized that i was being hired to do keynotes and there were people sitting in an audience waiting for me to speak i’m like that’s that’s actually not true that people don’t want to hear what i have to say they’re actually sitting here waiting to hear what i have to say and they’re paying me for that by the way which is and so i i go back to that all the time and i’m just i i i’m amazed that uh you know the the thing that you think is not the thing is is almost always the thing and and sometimes we forget because it is so obvious to us yes right yes um i have to remind myself sometimes that like you know if you’re looking at a journey you know like a road map like i’m down here on the road but some people are back here and and when i was there that thing made a lot of sense to me and uh so i have to just those things right you can’t it’s so natural or you feel like well my goodness everybody knows this so i’m just going to skip to the new stuff right no every and and what i find is when i do skip to the new stuff everybody’s still they’re like back they’re like wait how did we get here and i’m like oh well you have to do this and they’re like oh and i’m like oh here we go again like there’s the there’s the stuff that i almost didn’t mention or didn’t right so jason what’s your biggest learning as a business owner

it’s hard it’s just you know i i think i think the world has made you know insert the the big names that come to mind um you know the jeff bezos the the elon musk’s the her name’s escaping me right now but the lady who started spanx you know you um you see some of these people who you know have this what looks like a really lavish lifestyle right and sure they can afford to do some amazing things but um it never it never ends you know when you when you when you get a paycheck from somewhere um you leave that place and you go home and for the most part you can probably like it doesn’t matter if you don’t open your email until tomorrow or you know three days from now it just and as a business owner you know especially as fanatical as i am about branding like it’s it’s my brand like this is i almost more than your baby right like this is this is my thing and uh trusting that to other people is really hard um opening yourself to critique which i think you should but that’s hard um the fact that it just never stops um figuring out what work-life balance looks like during covid like i worked in this in this room i’ve got those office doors behind me and i started a thing like my commute was i would and i would turn off that little fire light that’s over my shoulder i would close these doors and i would take my dog for a walk that was my commute and and i did not come back in here that’s not because there weren’t things to do there’s my i never get to the end of my to-do list right i just never i because there’s always content there’s like there’s another video you could do there’s another sales call you can make there’s another follow-up there’s a a personal note you could send there’s a whatever um it just it it never ends um at the same time it’s probably one of the top two or three most rewarding things i’ve ever done in my life so you talked about it being a baby i hear that a lot and usually why that happens right is the first two or three years are really really really hard right and and you put in the hustle and grind and the sweat equity and and those who figure it out figure it out and and you start to have the successes and now it’s like and it it does feel like a baby because you you’ve birthed your business right so the the biggest challenge that i face with with my clients is is what you said is letting go right of you know the the book what got us here won’t get us there right is the idea of well now i’ve got i do have to let go right i have to delegate some stuff outsource some stuff because i can’t do everything but i got to this success because i did do everything right and so it’s hard yeah and and just and trusting that you know i’m i don’t think you’ll ever find somebody who’s gonna work as hard as you yeah um and learning to be okay with that yeah if if you really want it to grow because you i mean eventually it’s going to outgrow you in some space or multiple places and if you really want it to grow which i think we do like right i’d rather be working um and have other people doing things that i’m not good at but you have you have to be willing to know that they’re not going to do it exactly the way that you did and that’s okay and i think i would imagine you run into a lot of people who are not okay with that and that’s you got to pry it out of their fingers and one of the things i the the joke that i asked them is okay so how long have you been doing this you know it’s not uncommon to 20 30 some odd years so you’ve got 30 years of expertise in your head how long was your onboarding uh two weeks of shadowing so you expect them to be able to do 30 years of expertise in in two weeks all right right let’s let’s put some let’s document some of that stuff and get it right get a how-to video or something that they can go back to when they forget because they’re not going to remember everything you told them in that period right yeah and you mentioned capacity like the the the aha the the you know that bfo moment blinding flash to the obvious moment is is when we all realize that the the company can only grow to the capacity of of the people that are in it so if you’re a solopreneur right you only have a certain number of wheat hours in a day that you can work and that’s as big as the company can ever get yeah unless you bring on people to allow you know other more capacity in the business right so jason we know that success doesn’t happen in isolation so what’s one of the biggest challenges you faced during the your time as an owner and who’s somebody who came alongside you to help you get through that

i would imagine that this answer is probably in this time a similar answer to other people and that’s definitely covid um i mean friday march 13th will live in infamy for me forever as a business owner because literally that’s the day the world shut down i was supposed to sign the largest contract that i had ever would have ever signed up into that moment on that friday we had a call we’d already gone back and forth with the contract and made i mean it was literally a formality and that week all the dominoes started falling and they canceled the final four and some other stuff and i was like oh man this is bad and i’m like well at least i have this gig right and i got an email on a thursday afternoon that said hey jason you know this is impacting us in a major way we’re we’re like immediately like stopping the bleeding anywhere that we possibly can and uh like canceled the call i didn’t even get a chance to like could we do this or could we do that um so definitely that was just i mean i i don’t i don’t think anybody could have prepared for that i don’t think anybody could have you know i don’t i don’t think that was in anybody’s you know scenarios for business continuity you know when there’s a it probably is now yeah it’s probably a standard now uh it wasn’t at the time but definitely getting through that you know dealing with that and and i will say for me like just learning to pivot like learning to i bought this microphone and um i basically set up a home studio here and started i i can’t tell you how many people and i heard somebody i was on a webinar with 10 speakers literally from all over the world i think on like march 18th that next week and of the 10 speakers only two people had professional microphones and it was so obvious the difference i got this was the last microphone like this in the city of indianapolis amazon had already sold out i drove up to noblesville which is like an hour for me and got it from best buy and just pivot like yeah keep like well that didn’t work let’s see if this works let’s see if this were and i think that there are an awful lot of people who who either ran out ran out of ideas or ran out of energy or both and i’ve been blessed with a stupid amount of energy and a ridiculous amount of ideas and so one of my friends has a mug that says optimistic to the point of stupidity that’s that’s me and i just just keep going so jason if i ask you to pick three people that have been a key part of your business success who are those three and how they help you i think first in all that would be brandon wilson who is a fellow coach and peer of mine we have um every thursday at 8 30 um for i’m pretty sure it’s been over two years now we just check in with each other you know how you doing and there were some weeks that we were we it was almost a contest of who was doing worse like who could complain like uh we didn’t make we did sort of make a pact with each other to not you know leave ourselves in that space so he was he’s definitely one of them

secondly would be my good friend duane who works at iu health and at the very beginning of this we had uh he’s a he’s a vp and he’s a he’s just an amazing leader but he brought me in uh he gave me some of the first paid gigs that i ever had and um i’ll tell you what there’s nothing like this the shot in the arm of getting a check uh doing something that you’re not a hundred percent convinced that you can do right like you believe that you can and you and you have great high hopes that it will work out the way that it does but but like to get the feedback and that led to um that led to several other gigs um and i would say you know next would really be um

and she probably should have been first but but would be my wife because through all of this i mean we’ve had these these four years oh my gosh have just been tumultuous years on several different levels with kids leaving and sickness and the pandemic and going back to grad school and just all kinds of things and she has always especially when i don’t believe in myself she has always said like i believe in you and that that includes last summer when it was so bad that i was working at the target warehouse every weekend through the summer and she’s like look this is temporary i know it sucks we’ll get through it um and it’s amazing what words like that from people that matter can do i’ll use some fire analogy like the fuel that that can pour on your fire and how long that will burn um there’s there’s no substitute for that that’s awesome so jason just wrapping up here if there was something catastrophic that happened in the business who’s the first person you call and what would you need and want from them

i would say the first person i would call is my friend kent huber i mean first and foremost i would call my wife because she would need to know that um but from a business perspective would be my friend kent huber he is a business owner himself he’s uh built and sold businesses he’s worked in businesses uh he’s hustled for a ridiculous amount of time and uh he has great perspective he’s you know there’s something to be said i think for people who have gone before you and again like walked through the fire right that that you’re walking through currently because when you’re walking through the fire all you can see is that it’s burning you and it hurts you can’t really see what’s what comes out of that on the other side and he’s he’s just an incredibly

he just has he’s got a calming force about him and a very but also a very practical like he would be able to talk me off the ledge and then help me figure out how to step back from the ledge as well so like talk you off but then also like okay now we got to go you know to you know to use what’s behind you what what’s the action we need to take like what do we need to go do and he would be the person that would help me do that so cool so jason it sounds like you’ve been blessed with some incredible people that have helped you along the journey yes we had them all on the show here today what would you want to say to them

ah that hits me

i think they know this

but i would want them to hear um that there’s no way i could have done this without them and

because i am an optimist to the point of stupidity they have helped me see some things that um i was not able to see and there’s there’s no greater gift there’s no greater gift than people who believe in you can can pour fuel on your fire but that can also be honest enough to say i’m not sure like you need to think about that um because there are a lot of people who will tell you you’re dumb you know for doing whatever it is you’re doing these people have the relationship and the trust and the respect that i’m willing to listen and they’re willing to share and that’s that’s gold man that’s gold amen yeah jason i love your on authenticity um i love that you lead with your heart it’s just so refreshing so thank you for for being real with us today it’s been a pleasure having you on the show jason and thank you so much for being here yeah thank you thanks so much to everyone who tuned in thanks for listening to the self-made is a myth show with your host coach tim camsell be sure to help us spread this movement by liking the show and posting it on your social media and to join our movement go to be mad together dot com alright folks that’s a wrap make sure to pay it forward and we’ll see you all next time take care