May 7, 2024

Episode #140: Brian Wheeler – Vertical Immersive

Brian Wheeler was born and raised in Kentucky, but has called Indiana his home since 2000. He is married to his wonderful wife Loree and have 6 kids together and 2 grandkids. Brian calls himself a Kingdom entrepreneur following his calling to steward multiple organizations in growth through Kingdom Culture and mindsets. This Kingdom ecosystem is developed around The Vertical Life brand with service companies ranging from wealth management to a cutting edge immersive learning environment called Vertical Immersive, a college alternative for aspiring Christian leaders. Brian firmly believes that we should do “everything unto the Lord” and holds that our work is truly another form of worship to joyfully serve the King of k


Intro: You’re listening to the Self Made is a Myth, Make a Difference Together Show with your host coach Tim Campsall where we talk with successful business owners to hear the stories of their journeys in building their successful businesses. And more importantly, we recognize the folks who helped them excel because we know that achieving business success is not something we can do on our own.

Coach Tim Campsall: Hello, everyone. This is Coach Tim Campsall, and I’m excited to have a fellow business owner from Indiana with us today. Something unique about my guest is that he loves to play the piano, guitar, and he sings in his downtime. He loves to read in the morning with his one-month-old grandbaby, and he’s most proud of his six kids.

Each who have a heart for Jesus and they love others and like to serve others. It’s my pleasure to welcome Brian to the show today. Hi Brian.

Brian Wheeler: Hi, how’s it going?

Coach Tim Campsall: I am awesome thanks for asking. Hey, let’s start with having you introduce yourself So tell us your first and last name and a little bit of your personal story like where you were born and live, and about your family and hobbies.

Brian Wheeler: Okay. I’m Brian Wheeler, originally from Kentucky. Don’t hold it against me. I’ve been a Hoosier now for 25 years. So I’m all up on all the sports teams here and good to go. I have a family with six children ranging from the ages of 24 to 16 now. So they’re all stacked in there. And I’ve got a few of them out of the house and one married off, soon to be a second, and I’ve got a couple of grandbabies already, so just enjoying life.

Coach Tim Campsall: Fantastic. You mentioned enjoying reading to your one-month-old. That’s pretty special.

Brian Wheeler: Yeah, it’s man, I tell you, it’s precious. You don’t, everyone talks about, that transition from being a parent to a grandparent being so cool, but you really just don’t get the gist of it until you get to do it.

And so just being able to bring her into my environment in the morning and in the quiet of the morning and she’ll sleep better when she’s resting on me. And that gives me a chance for me to do some reading. I read my Bible and read some books and listen to her coup and on all the things.

And of course, once she gets crabby a couple hours later, and then I see mom coming back in the picture, I’m happy to just give her the handoff. It’s great.

Coach Tim Campsall: Hey, Brian, is there a funny story that your family likes to tell about you that you’d be willing to share with us today?

Brian Wheeler: Man, I bet you I have a hundred funny stories that my family would tell on me about.

So it’s really just a matter of which one to go with.

I’ll tell you just one recently because I’m a very extroverted social person, but sometimes I don’t always pick up on like social cues or I miss names and so I miss really like little subtle things we laugh about this because our family like we’re all differently like that way like we all have our struggles right.

And so I was in church recently, and there was a new family there, lady, and, she had some guys with her. And I’m talking to them as if a couple of the kids and I’m looking at one okay, like this guy’s probably the husband, but he looks like a young husband, but running with it.

And then I realized later Oh no, that was one of her adult children. So yeah, there’s that. Yeah, so fun times.

Coach Tim Campsall: Thank you for sharing. That’s awesome. Hey, Brian, tell us, how did the business come about and at what point did you have the confidence that you could run your own business?

Brian Wheeler: Great question.

I’ll start with the second part of that question. I’ve been blessed with the confidence to run business since I was young. I drank the Kool Aid from a young age. I come from a background of entrepreneurs, thankfully. So my mom, my dad were in a family business. My older brother got me into lawn mowing at 13 and he was a little bit older.

I was his first employee. So I’m sure, he just worked me to death.

And then after a few years of that, I was like, this is great and all, but being employed not so great for me. So I decided to start a company. So my first business was a pressure cleaning company when I was 16.

And I hired a couple of my buddies to work for me. And I did the sales and the marketing and the quotes. So that was fun. And then as I went, And as the years passed, I started more new businesses and realized how much I enjoy just the process of starting and growing and scaling businesses. So eventually got into wealth management which led into real estate, which led into a wedding venue.

And then the venture I’m working on right now is actually called Vertical Immersive. It’s an immersive learning environment. So it’s like a college alternative. And this one particularly, I wouldn’t say that I actually started with the courage to do it like I do with a lot of the other ventures.

Sometimes when we start. Business it’s out of, I’ve heard you say it on other podcasts, like out of necessity, a lot of people are getting the show going, Hey, I saw a gap in the market. This needed to exist. And so therefore I did this one for me was there was an existing business that was running this immersive learning environment, but they hadn’t scaled it yet.

And when they explained the concept to me, it sounded like really cool. But at the same time, it looked really hard. Like it had all these components to it of, like running a studio and an educational component and a business component. I was like, man, this is nuts. And I got to the place where they were ready to transition out.

And so it was going to be an acquisition for me. And actually, I was trying to help them find a buyer. That’s why they’d approached me as Hey, we heard you buy, sell businesses or help others do it. And but here’s what happened. No joke. I’m thinking about it. I’m like, I don’t know anyone that would buy this business because the risk is like off the charts and it’s so complex, but it’s so cool.

I’m going to pray about it and see if someone comes to mind. I feel like God was like you’re the guy that’s going to take this over. And so I was like, Oh, okay. Lord, if you want me to do this, I will. But I put out a fleece. You ever heard anyone talk about that before? It’s like a, a proverbial, like God, if you’re in this, show me that it’s new.

And so I had put out this fleece and God answered it in a very overwhelming way to where I was like, okay, we’re doing this. So I feel like in this case, it was like, God gave me the confidence that I didn’t have. And it’s been a real joy and a pleasure ever since then, quite a rollercoaster but a pretty amazing ride.

Coach Tim Campsall: Oh, that’s fantastic. I know you’ve got a couple of businesses. Is there one or a multiple that you’d like to tell us a little bit more detail about? So what’s the company name? What do you guys do? How do you help people?

Brian Wheeler: Sure. Vertical Immersive is the one I just discussed. And so we can dig in that a little bit and it is an immersive learning environment.

So it’s a college alternative for students that are faith-based, it’s faith-focused and they understand that there’s a grander story kind of going on in this world. That’s a God story. And that they’re trying to figure out how they fit within it. And then the other part of that is that they learn by doing.

So again, being an entrepreneur I went to college for a little while and it wasn’t for me that it was very, academic and very just sitting in the classroom and lectures. And I was like, man, I just cannot do this. I learned by getting my hands into things. And this immersive learning environment is just that Vertical Immersive is for the people that want to learn about marketing and sales.

Digital storytelling and entrepreneurship specifically. This is the place to go because they’re going to actually learn by doing, they get their hands into projects right away. So our first year students. We actually work with nonprofits, usually faith-based one, but not always. And so we’re taking on kind of clients into our marketing studio and saying, Hey, you probably have needs that have been unmet and learning how to build a marketing program or build a website or build a funnel of building people to follow and contribute to your nonprofit, but they don’t usually have the resources.

To do all those things, right? It gets expensive in a regular marketing firm. So they become clients and our students actually do the work. So while they’re learning how to do marketing programs, they actually build them for nonprofits. And at the end of the semester, that becomes their capstone is like, how well did you do in launching this comp, this nonprofit successfully in the project that they had.

So they’ll do that for two semesters. Then the third semester they become actual employees of Vertical Studios, our marketing company, where we work with for profit clients. And we do the same processes over and over, but again, it’s at a subsidized rate, like the clients that are like, and they have all these big needs, they want, social media projects, they want video content, they want all the things.

But as like all that stuff is, it can get crazy expensive. So the needs are high, the grade’s high, but usually the budget’s small. But inside the studio with. Students doing the work. We can get it done more economically. And at the same time, the students are now learning and they’re building up their portfolio of clients that they’ve worked with.

And so by the time they graduate, like they know how to do all this stuff. And the best part is they know how to do it with all the latest and greatest AI tools. Cause as soon as new things release we’re evaluating and saying okay, is this going to take the place of what we were using before?

And that’s what employers are looking for that I found too, is that. All my buddies that were like, you’re crazy. You’ve lost your mind. You’re taking over. This is like a school, right? Like a college what are you doing? You own a wealth management firm, a wedding venue. I’m like, these things don’t go together.

And I was like my life doesn’t make sense outside of cry. So there’s that.

But then I asked him the question, I’m like, let’s sum this up. If you were to hire someone that is your company’s growing to take over the marketing in house. If you had finally gotten to the stage where it’s okay, we’re actually going to hire someone and they’re going to nurture marketing and social media and video content, all these things.

You tell me if you had to choose between two candidates, one is a college recent graduate with a marketing degree. They worked as a barista the last two and a half years, or they went to Vertical Immersive and they did 20, 30 client projects over two and two years plus and everything else is equal.

Which one are you going to hire? Yeah. And every time they’re like, Oh, second kid cause they did all the work. They have the experience, they know how to do it. And they know all the tools. They’ve gone through the kind of the maturity flow of, like how do I do hard things? So that’s really what vertical immersive is about that.

And we focus really heavy on character development. That’s the other thing that a lot of my buddies that are business owners tell me they can’t find these days is they may even find someone that might have the knowledge base or the theory of how to do it. They, first of all, have to reteach them.

Cause they usually don’t know. But then they start having to work on developing their character because there’s just a devoid of that out there. And so we spend enormous amount of time on leadership development, on character, on ethos, on ethics, on like, how do we do good business? And therefore they become better employees right out of the gate that are super trainable, but they’re actually ready to go.

Coach Tim Campsall: That’s fantastic. Wow. And how long have, has it been since you’ve taken over?

Brian Wheeler: Yeah, so I took over in August. This thing’s been around for 10 years. However in August I took over, they had 11 different platforms they were operating in, meaning like they had 11 different disciplines that they wanted to teach to.

And some of them were in like an IT spaces and I am not an IT guy. Like, I’m glad it’s there, but I don’t, I’m not proficient in it. And so I didn’t really want to be an expert in a lot of things. So we narrowed the scope down and just said, let’s be, Like excellent at teaching and doing marketing, sales, digital storytelling, and entrepreneurship.

And that’s it. So that’s what we’ve narrowed it down to since August.

Coach Tim Campsall: Very exciting. Hey, Brian, share a story where someone pushed you or inspired you that you could do it, even though maybe you didn’t think that you could and the impact of that person had on you.

Brian Wheeler: Yeah, so same thing. I think that there’s so many times in life where we are challenged with something in front of us that, maybe we don’t feel like inside of us, we’re capable or more to the point, like we have that imposter syndrome, that I don’t belong in this room or with these people are at this caliber.

I think we can all relate to that in different stages of our lives even if we’ve had a high level of stress. Success. I think as we go into the next thing that God calls us to. So I would say for me again I’m just going to go back to vertical cause it’s just what’s on the tip of my mind right now.

But when I felt called to do this, I felt completely inadequate. I was, looking at this okay I literally don’t know much about any of this stuff. Like I had like tidbits of, okay, I understand business. I understand marketing. I have a heart for students and all this, but I don’t know how to run a college for Pete’s sake.

I don’t know how to do any of this. And in that case, I really just feel like. The person in this case was God. So it’s, maybe a little theory like for some, but I feel like God just kept challenging me to, I kept getting this visual every morning to to step out of the boat, there’s this there’s a scripture that talks about one of the disciples seeing Jesus on the water.

And he’s if it’s you, Lord, ask me and I’ll come out on the water with you. And he takes that first step and he’s like staring Jesus in the eyes. And so he’s able to walk on water towards Jesus. And then he takes his eyes off Jesus and he starts looking at the storms and he starts to sink.

I would say that’s a really perfect metaphor for all of our lives. Mine, especially where, when I’m trying to do this hard thing of this new college, this immersive learning environment where I was like, God, I know you’re calling me to do this, but I am super inept, unequipped, unskilled, unlearned in doing this thing.

And every day God just kept saying Brian just step out of the boat. Just take one step and then keep your eyes focused on me. And then I’ll take care of the rest. And so that’s what’s the way it’s been. It’s been like a wild adventure. And that’s the way. I think good business development does go right.

Sometimes like it’s just a wild adventure to go on in your life and you’re willing to just take risks that maybe you normally wouldn’t, but somewhere inside of you trust and you know that it’s going to work out because again, this is something that may be God seeded in your heart or you feel very strongly that needs to exist.

Yeah. You just keep moving forward in faith and you don’t even see the big picture. You don’t see 10 steps ahead. One, two and, it works out and that’s what faith requires of us. That’s also what the entrepreneurial journey just like requires of us. Doesn’t it?

Coach Tim Campsall: Yeah, for sure.

You mentioned imposter syndrome and mindset is absolutely huge. I often reference it as being at least 90%, if not more of whether we’re going to be successful or not in terms of what do we believe? What do we think? We all have at times we all have those records that play in our head of you mentioned, right?

We’re not good enough. I’m not capable. I’m not ready. But the reality is and I share your faith is that. God has given us everything that we need to address the thing that’s right in front of us, even when we doubt and fear, though, there is an exercise of going through those, what we call self limiting beliefs and working through them and say, Nope, that’s a lie, or that’s not accurate, or that’s not true.

And. And I know that, I’m here for a reason. And I’ve got everything that I need to be able to tackle this next journey and having that faith and belief in ourself and knowing that there’s a greater, a greater calling or a greater purposes. Absolutely.

Brian Wheeler: There’s the the Bible verse that says it’s one of my favorites.

I gravitate towards often again, cause we can get into these fear modes, right? Like you wake up one day and be like, things are going great. I’m like, Oh my gosh, it’s all going to crash and burn. What have I done? And there’s a Bible verse that says, I’ve not given you a spirit of fear, but one of power of love and self discipline, depending on the translation the way it reads.

And I love that verse because we can have fear. And that’s normal, right? That’s like the warning light going on that, Hey, there’s something you need to address or whatever. But basically I feel like God’s saying don’t sit in it very long because that’s not the spirit I’ve given you to sit and fret and dwell on and move into that mentality.

God’s you’re more than conquerors like within. Within us, right? We have the Holy Spirit to achieve what the Bible says is a measurably more through the Holy Spirit than what we could hope or imagine. And I believe as entrepreneurs that’s so true. It’s true for everybody. But I think particularly for entrepreneurs, like God has given us this desire and this inner seated ability to look at the world differently and say, There is immeasurably more to be done in this world for good and to help and serve people.

What does that look like and how do we get there? And I think God walks along with us in those things and says, yes, it is good. Keep moving, keep trucking, don’t sit in that spirit of fear very long.

Coach Tim Campsall: Yeah. Building on that, and I don’t remember the exact verse, but it’s, don’t worry about tomorrow because, tomorrow will take care of itself.

Brian Wheeler: Yes, absolutely,

Coach Tim Campsall: Focus on where we are today and what we’re what’s right in front of us and do what we already know how to do and continue to do that day after day. And that doesn’t mean that we don’t have a, paint a picture of, and envision what, the long term looks like, but we don’t have to worry about all of the things that we have to learn and figure out, over that long term, we just have to focus on what’s right in front of us.

Brian Wheeler: Absolutely. Absolutely. And, I think the added piece to that, at least again, for my life, maybe this resonates with you or not, but if I waited for everything in my life to be in good shape, like I would never get anything done. And if I waited for Oh, when I get this thing over here in my life sorted out, or there’s this one thing that’s not going well, therefore, it invalidates me from being able to keep, who am I to speak into people?

And I think that’s, The that all throughout the Bible, right? Like Moses, all of them, everyone was like, not me, Lord. I’m not like, look, we’re not waiting for you to be ready or worthy or, eloquent, I just need you to be obedient. I just need you to be willing. And so I think that’s the spirit of entrepreneurship.

It’s just that willingness to step into the unknown and saying Hey, I don’t have all the things figured out. And no, I, if I’m being honest with myself, I’m not fully equipped and I can’t validate everything about my character right now because I’m still working on me and that’s like a lifetime thing, but that’s okay.

Yeah. And, but God’s going to use me in this, in the state that I am today and then continue to build on that.

Coach Tim Campsall: And it also inspires others because, the whole purpose of this show is that, there’s a perception that everybody’s got it together and everybody, our overnight successes and why we have the show is to dig into all the little nuances and things that happen along the way.

Because when I hear somebody else’s, Imperfect story and then see what they’ve accomplished. That’s way more inspiring. I will if they went through that and they were successful, then the things I’m dealing with aren’t going to prevent me from getting where I want to be.

Brian Wheeler: Oh, absolutely.

How many like hours and days do you have, sir? Cause I could give you all kinds of failure stories, right?

Coach Tim Campsall: Like they,

Brian Wheeler: They are, just make a whole wall full of targets that I threw that missed, yeah, that’s, yeah, good.

Coach Tim Campsall: Guys, just to that point, what’s been your biggest learning as a business owner?

Brian Wheeler: Biggest learning, it’s, probably something you’ve had other people say or whatever, but I think the biggest thing is that not to be afraid of failure. Like all of us, I sometimes struggle with, Doing something new because I’m concerned that it might fail. But our biggest learnings come through our failures.

Usually, at least in my life, I find that or, as they say, like when I’m on the mountain top and things are going great, like cool. But I don’t really grow a whole lot. Usually on the mountaintop, like I’m in celebration mode, but when I have to come off the mountain and I go back down to the valley of despair, when I’m in the struggle, when I’m like, I’m not sure if this is going to work or not.

Is when I grow the most, when my character grows, when I forge new friendships, when I seek the Lord the most, when I’m like fill in the blank, but a hundred things. And so I think that’s the thing that I’ve come to terms with the most, even though I’m, I’m still. Not always getting that right.

Coach Tim Campsall: Yeah

Brian Wheeler: But it’s just being okay with it. Failure is a part of the educational process It’s part of the learning. It’s part of the character growth and as much as I don’t like it like I need it

Coach Tim Campsall: I have a slide that I use every morning to remind me that it’s basically three mountaintops in a row so you could think of it as you know the next three years and then You know that there’s a zigzagging line of the path to get to the top of the 1st mountain and then a dip to the valley and then a zigzag to the 2nd and the reminder is that the path is not linear.

And every time I’m on one of those zigzags, what I remind myself is, okay, what is, what am I supposed to learn here? There’s a reason that I’m over here feeling like I’m off course, but there’s something that, that God’s needing me to learn or for me to work through or for me to understand to prepare me for that next incline.

Brian Wheeler: Definitely. Most definitely. Yeah, and you can’t really shortcut the process, honestly, we tried to go very well.

Coach Tim Campsall: You’ve probably had this yourself as well. When I have tried to shortcut it. I always end up coming back to that spot to relearn that lesson.

Brian Wheeler: Yes, absolutely. Yeah. We do the same thing with our children, right?

Like we, I think as parents, sometimes we, we’re all guilty. At least I’m guilty of like over protecting them. I don’t want. I don’t want them to go through the pain, the suffering and the thing. So I find a way to build a bridge to help prevent that from them. And at the end of the day, it’s no, actually they needed to learn that the hard way, because that’s the only way that they’re currently wanting to learn, like they didn’t want to learn the easy way.

And so I keep building the bridges, but I’m actually building the bridges to a bigger fall for them. And I’m like, man, this would have been easier if I just tried not to. Scaffold this out and just let them go through the thing, and let them take ownership of that and struggle and learn and grow.

But we do that.

Coach Tim Campsall: We know that business success doesn’t happen in isolation. So Brian, tell us about one of your biggest challenges as a business owner, and maybe a colleague or a fellow business owner who came alongside and helped you through it.

Brian Wheeler: Yeah, that’s great. So I would say this is probably again, one you’ve heard a lot, but we, as business owners, we can all feel like we’re isolated on an Island and there’s just us that understands, the, everything of everything, in terms of our struggles and all the things. And I joined a truth at work group a long time ago, like years. My, my good friend, Ray Hilbert started that up and he started off another thing, similar to that called kingdom factor now. And I think groups like that, depending on where you’re at in business and what type of business you’re in perhaps, but I think being in a group like truth at work or kingdom factor, or, name them.

There’s like a bunch of them, they provide us. As entrepreneurs, that fellowship structure that we need. And so when I am struggling in my businesses and usually inside of a group like that, I might, have the, at least the courage to finally, because we’ve built a relationships to be safe, to say the thing that we wouldn’t say otherwise to someone else about the struggle, because we want to mask it.

We want to hide it. We want to put on a good face, and we know we shouldn’t, but we do.

Coach Tim Campsall: But in

Brian Wheeler: those groups, like we can take the mask off and just be like, Hey, here’s where I blew it the other day at work and I don’t even know how to fix it. And then someone else says, Oh yeah, I did that one.

I did that one two years ago. Yeah, that one was bad. I, yeah, I didn’t like that, but here’s how, but here’s how we resolve that. Let me help you again, expedite your learning curve here and get you through this. And so then that brother, that person comes alongside of you, but then everyone else comes alongside too and say, Hey, like we’re in this with you.

And I think there’s a lot of value in community in whatever form it looks like, right? Whether it’s coaching and friendships, but we all have to have those relationships where we’re being poured into. We have someone to walk alongside of us and then we have someone to pour into.

Coach Tim Campsall: Yeah. There’s nothing worse than feeling like. We’re alone and that we’re the only one that has this issue or challenge and that everybody else seems to have figured this business journey out. And it must just be me that hasn’t. And my goodness, I’m not going to say anything to anyone. Cause I feel like I’m the dumb one and everyone else has got it all together.

Intro: Yep.

Coach Tim Campsall: Being able to. You said to just let down that guard and say, all yeah, I don’t have it figured out and I’m struggling and it’s eaten away at me. And to your point and then have others come alongside and yep, I’ve been there too. There’s just such a relief of really you, who I thought is, has it all together.

You had that problem too.

Brian Wheeler: And that is the coaching model, like you’re in the coaching space, right? So it’s the. Providing accountability where there wasn’t any before to say, Hey, you know what? I will do this. And you’re like, are you going to do it? Cause we’re going to be back on a call.

I’m like, I’m going to find out did you do it? And so there’s that piece. And then there’s like all the things in business where it’s we’ve built up knowledge bases, but there’s still things we don’t know. We don’t know, especially when we decide to step into new spaces or new markets or new target client bases, or, fill in the blank.

There’s things we don’t know. We don’t know. And good coaching, good community, all those things. helps to fill in the gaps and lift us up to go, Oh yeah, I didn’t think about that way or didn’t wasn’t thinking about from that perspective, this is very helpful. And so there’s a lot of natural components that comes through coaching and accountability groups and friendships, even that we just need to not just to survive, but to really thrive.


Coach Tim Campsall: So Brian I’m going to put you on the spot here and ask you to pick three people in your business owner journey that, You’re most grateful for them being there for you to help with your businesses growth. So who are those three people and how they help you?

Brian Wheeler: I only get to pick three, huh? All right.

I’m gonna, I’m gonna cheat. I’m gonna make it four because obviously I’ve spent a lot of time talking about God and Jesus. So obviously like that faith component is like foundational for me. If I didn’t have that none of this works. None of it makes sense. But but people currently, doing life with me that, that are still in the flesh would be again, Ray Hilbert again, speaks volumes into my life in different ways and the things that he’s achieved and also just willing to strive and go for and then there’s the coaches under him that, that have mattered a lot in my life because he brought him around another good friend of mine.

His name is Mark Warnley and Mark is actually still in the front end of his entrepreneurial journey, but. I love his heart because he sees things from a spiritual perspective even when we’re in a business context. And so he’s always looking at it from the kingdom bottom line and just, what is God calling you to do instead of just Hey This is another, client opportunity or another business opportunity.

Like he speaks the gospel in that understanding that like it’s all the Lords and we need to come at this from a very stewardship mentality. The third one I’ll say is Eric Cooper from the stone table. I don’t know if you’ve had the pleasure or privilege of meeting Eric. Yeah. Eric has spoken my life in ways that I probably really hadn’t fully accounted for really up until maybe just thinking about in this moment.

And that he helped me to build the theology around how our faith and work. Are integrated like that’s the way that we’re supposed to do life Like these things are not bifurcated as eric likes to say you know we can easily spend a lot of our lives saying like there’s our church life and our spiritual life and then there’s the work that we do to earn a living and all that and Eric was one of the early ones to point out to me and keep speaking into that These things are all integrated that our work really is a form of worship.

And therefore it gives greater purpose into our daily tasks, the way that we go about life and brings it all to a very purpose filled and adventurous life. So those would be the three I would say.

Coach Tim Campsall: That’s fantastic. I love it.

Brian Wheeler: Hey, for the 10 people that I didn’t mention, I had to pick three on the fly.

There was probably 10 more of you. I can just start spinning on names. So I love you. I’m sorry. I didn’t throw your name off. Okay. There we go.

Coach Tim Campsall: I love it. Yes. That’s always one of my favorite questions because yes invariably it’s tough when you have a lot of people in your life. So thank you for playing along with me there.

Brian, as you think about the next one to three years, what is your either number one priority or challenge that you need to solve in order to achieve your goals?

Brian Wheeler: That’s a great question. Tim, I would say that the part that I had to come to terms with in the last year or two that I’m still trying to like, get my hands around fully was being really okay with the way that God made me. What I mean by that is, and I wanted to say this directly, like all the entrepreneurs that are listening to me and maybe others that would say I’m the oddball.

Why can’t I fit into the mold? We tend to go to a lot of different conferences and things that talk about what it looks like to be an excellent leader, to be an excellent CEO. And, those two kind of go hand in hand and they would say things like, you need to focus on one thing and be excellent at it.

And I do want to be excellent at some things, that’s for sure. But I don’t have the mindset to be excellent at just one thing, to be like an excellent CEO. Matter of fact, I learned that I’m a terrible CEO. No joke. One of the greatest liberating moments for me was realizing that the way God made me was to be more like a chief visionary officer, someone that has the big vision and the dream of what an organization should look like, and then how to get it there.

And then. Put it into the hands of more competent, better-talented people than me to shepherd it in along into its maturity. So to bring a CEO alongside of me. So like an integrator, the EOS system, that entrepreneur operating system. And that was a good day for me. And then to look at other things and go, Oh, like I need to let go of this and delegate this.

This person can probably learn to do it as well. If not better than me, I need to let go. I need to let go. I need to let go. I need to let go of my control and I need to delegate. Okay. And I also just need to be okay with, this is the way God made me. It is good. Maybe I am a weirdo. I don’t know. It doesn’t matter.

This is the way God made me. And I think a lot of entrepreneurs can resonate with that. Like we want to wear all the hats because people tell us we’re supposed to wear all the hats. And the truth is no, like maybe up front, the very first, like you got to wear all the hats, but very quickly you need to learn to let go and then see the way that God made you and just push into that identity that God’s given you drive towards that.

And then let God do the rest, let him bring the people and the resources and the people that are more talented than you to do the things that, that they’re uniquely made to do too, so that we can work together in this ecosystem. So I would say for me, like the next year or two, the priority still is just to keep pushing into that concept of allowing others to step in that are uniquely created to do things inside the organization, to grow it.

And be okay with that. Because I, as an entrepreneur, I think because we got, when we started from the beginning of our journeys where we had to wear all the hats, then over time, I think we’ve created the habit then of having a real hard time of letting go of those things when we really need to, and probably should have a long time ago.

Coach Tim Campsall:I love that concept. We. We call it super heroitis where okay, yeah, you know in the beginning Yes, we have to wear all the hats because it’s just us or you know just us and a couple of people and we’ve got to figure things out And it’s not a linear path and we get good at multitasking and learning stuff and getting it to work and then and then superhero I just kicks in, which is no one can do the job as good as me and, or as fast as me, or it’s just easier if I do it myself versus teaching somebody else.

And oftentimes in that exact moment, that is true. But when those moments come up multiple times and we’re, we’re spending time on those lower activities or lower value activities and not. leveraging our strengths it, it ends up becoming a bottleneck to the organization. And a lot of really good companies plateau because the owner hasn’t learned to let go and delegate and play their right role.

And their right role to your point can be different in different organizations based on what their passions and skills are.

Brian Wheeler: Absolutely. So that’s awesome.

Coach Tim Campsall: You’ve started that journey and you’re committed to continuing it. Brian Jim Rohn, a great business guru. One of his quotes is that we become the average of the five people that we spend the most time with.

So as you think about that quote, what advice would you have for other business owners and entrepreneurs who are trying to do it on their own.

Brian Wheeler: Yeah. Don’t do that. Don’t do that. Don’t do that. Man. Yeah. So I think that the best thing that I could say from experience is that we, Get in this place where we’re busy.

And so we don’t think we have the time to slow down and do relationship with others or sit in those groups or get the coaching or read the book or listen to God and spend the time with him. And the truth is. We can’t afford not to like if we’re going to grow, if we’re going to scale things for the kingdom of God or, whatever your purpose is, we have to be willing to slow down and take those times to connect with people because that’s again, where we grow the most and we get accountability and all the good things of life.

And so we just need to stop listening to the lies that we tell ourselves that we’re too busy. And we had to carve the time out. Cause I also feel like God honors that and gives her time back to us somehow. Like I, I call it God’s economy, not man’s economy, but like somehow, I’ll have a day where I’m like, I feel like I’m going to carve out four hours and just read this morning.

And people are like, are you insane? Like, how do you have the time to do that? I’m like, I’ve learned that I don’t have the time to not do that occasionally. And God gives it back to me sometimes tenfold. I don’t know how that makes sense, but it just does.

Coach Tim Campsall: It’s it’s interesting how sometimes just. A meeting will get canceled or moved or postponed.

And all of a sudden we’ve got that free time to, to do that thing that’s been weighing on our minds. It sounds like you’ve been blessed with some incredible people on your journey. If they were all here on the show today, what would you want to say to them?

Brian Wheeler: Thank you. I love you. You guys are my heroes.

Appreciate you. I’m excited to see what new chapter God has for you. And there’s so many more and I’m glad to be a part of the journey with you.

Coach Tim Campsall: Awesome. I love it, Brian. It’s been a pleasure speaking with you today. Thank you so much for being on the show.

Brian Wheeler: Absolutely. It was my pleasure.

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